Auxiliary Bishop of Astana (Kazakhstan), Athanasius Schneider, considers the presence and activity of the Priestly Fraternity of Saint Pius X to be “increasingly providential.” He makes this claim in the second part of an extensive interview given to Michael Haynes for The Catholic Herald. In it, he reviews the situation of the traditional Mass, the conflict with the SSPX, and what he describes as a serious doctrinal and liturgical crisis in the Holy See.
A Mass outside the Vatican
The interview comes on the eve of the Summorum Pontificum pilgrimage. This year, unlike last year, the pilgrimage will not be able to celebrate its pontifical Mass in the Vatican. Schneider, who will preside over it at Santa Maria Maggiore, personally delivered the organizers’ petition to Leo XIV during a private audience in December 2025. According to the British outlet, the negative response from the Secretariat of State did not arrive until August 2026.
A year and a half into the pontificate, the bishop believes the situation “has barely changed” compared to the measures adopted after Traditionis custodes. The restrictions “continue and, in some cases, the situation is even worsening,” with dioceses closing places where the celebration was previously permitted, something he describes as “a form of persecution.” He recalls asking the Pope for “a generous gesture as the common father of all his faithful” and laments that Vatican officials continue to treat the ancient rite “as if it were something dangerous.”
“A work of Divine Providence”
Schneider served as apostolic visitor to the SSPX at the Holy See’s request and knows its positions from within. According to him, the disagreement has remained the same for more than fifty years: Rome demands recognition that the Second Vatican Council is in conformity with tradition and acceptance of the liturgical reform as correct.
The prelate maintains that certain conciliar texts contain “evident ambiguities.” Of the Novus Ordo, he states that it contains “very clear Protestant tendencies” and undermines the sacrificial character of the Mass, even when celebrated according to the norms. He points in particular to the new offertory prayers and Eucharistic Prayer II. “We cannot continue with the Novus Ordo – we cannot. We cannot continue with the evident doctrinal ambiguities of certain statements of the Second Vatican Council. We must resolve them,” he asserts.
In this context, he describes the Fraternity’s work as “a work of Divine Providence.” Its role would be to remind the Holy See of the need to clarify conciliar statements that are “objectively doubtful and ambiguous” and to reform the Novus Ordo “in accordance with tradition.” The hermeneutic of continuity seems to him like “mental acrobatics, or squaring the circle.” He asks Rome to grant “freedom of debate” and to integrate the SSPX “at least gradually, step by step.”
Harshness toward tradition, tolerance toward heterodoxy
Regarding the Vatican’s response to the consecrations of July 1, Schneider believes an impartial observer would see it as “an emotional reaction, a harsh judgment,” with the intent to punish the Fraternity and eliminate its influence. He contrasts this with the treatment of the Bishop of Antwerp, whom he says has announced he will violate the legislation on celibacy without receiving any reprimand. He also compares it to the “extreme generosity” shown toward the Chinese Communist Party and the German Synodal Way. He further questions how something can be discriminated against that, he recalls, John Paul II declared legitimate.
The bishop goes so far as to claim that the Holy See has suffered, “to a certain extent,” a “hostile takeover.” He compares the situation to the Avignon papacy: a “spiritual exile” of doctrine and liturgy that, he assures, will end. As then with Saint Catherine of Siena and Saint Bridget of Sweden, today it will be families, young people, priests, and religious who contribute to that return, until God grants His Church “one-hundred-percent traditional popes.”